big bang vs. creation

sweetness · Post by **sweetness** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:26 am

lol, so he must be a supporter of Bush.

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Reaper · Post by **Reaper** » Thu Dec 07, 2006 4:57 pm

Stasi wrote:
flameofgod wrote: fair enough but just because the bible dones not undergo revision does not mean it is right or that it does not need revision. for instance all all the book in the bible were writtin down hundereds of years after the event and many things were lost in the traslation.

The Bible hasn't gone through revisions? The same Bible from back in the day is the same Bible all Christians all over the world use? I say unto thee, nay, for the Word of the Lord hath changed through the passage of time, with the appearance of new sects, and with changes in political climates. Evidently, the good word wasn't originally recorded as 'perfectly' as it should have been.

It hasn't had revisions in this way. It's been translated many times. The Bible itself hasn't had any additions.
And not every denomination has it's own Bible.

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TheSpaceAgeDude · Post by **TheSpaceAgeDude** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 5:30 pm

I actually have changed my mind recently...I want to believe in the big bang creating the world and us, however I also want to believe there is a God and I am sure there is....well actually there may not be, its something to make us feel like we have a guardian who makes sure we are safe, but I know there is an afterlife, so whether there is a God or not, who knows.
I am agnostic.

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Reaper · Post by **Reaper** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 5:32 pm

TheSpaceAgeDude wrote: I actually have changed my mind recently...I want to believe in the big bang creating the world and us, however I also want to believe there is a God and I am sure there is....well actually there may not be, its something to make us feel like we have a guardian who makes sure we are safe, but I know there is an afterlife, so whether there is a God or not, who knows.
I am agnostic.

Well, contrary to what some say, you CAN believe in the "big bang" and God. I am an example of this.

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TheSpaceAgeDude · Post by **TheSpaceAgeDude** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 5:35 pm

Ah....like...Big bang created us and jesus...and..then, jesus obviously was crucified and then is in heaven as the leader..
?Confused?
Mainly because I always get confused as whether God and Jesus are the same person..sorry, may sound stupid.

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Reaper · Post by **Reaper** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 5:48 pm

No, the Trinity (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) created us. Jesus (the Son) was not created from the big bang.
Yes, Christ is God and man at the same time.

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Clueless · Post by **Clueless** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 6:19 pm

life cant be made from nonliving objects though, how can the big bang have made the world and then somehow living cells popped up from the rocks?

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Reaper · Post by **Reaper** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 6:23 pm

Is God God?

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TheSpaceAgeDude · Post by **TheSpaceAgeDude** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:44 pm

Reaper wrote: Is God God?

You just confused the pea that is my brain..

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Stasi · Post by **Stasi** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:16 am

Clueless wrote: life cant be made from nonliving objects though, how can the big bang have made the world and then somehow living cells popped up from the rocks?

Personal incredulity disproves nothing. By other such concepts as the human concept of time and existence, no being can exist without a starting point. Does that concept necessarily disprove the existence of God simply because you or I have an issue with it? While I find it conceptual feasible that life could start on its own through some amount of luck or chance, it doesn't mean that I don't believe that such a thing must necessarily disprove the existence of God. I think the central theme to Christianity, as with many other religions, is the timelessness of the soul. Does a tree have a soul? Does the amoeba or bacterium have a soul? The only aspect of life, I feel, that may essentially be created by some deity is higher cognition and intellect, and the soul of each being, which exists even after its human vessel dies.

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Red Squirrel · Post by **Red Squirrel** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:37 am

One way to see if the big bang can happen is to take a glass jar, suck up all the air from it, and let it sit somewhere. See if something starts forming inside. Has to be 100% clean, sterilized, etc... not a single molecule should exist inside.

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Stasi · Post by **Stasi** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 1:05 am

Red Squirrel wrote: One way to see if the big bang can happen is to take a glass jar, suck up all the air from it, and let it sit somewhere. See if something starts forming inside. Has to be 100% clean, sterilized, etc... not a single molecule should exist inside.

Actually, I've read no version of the big bang theory that suggests the universe was created from nothing.

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flowergirlajg · Post by **flowergirlajg** » Thu Apr 12, 2007 6:43 pm

Well, maybe time is much longer for god, so he made the earth/made everything evolve in the time of the big bang. Lets say every second is a million years for god.
so seven days would be FOREVER to Him, so really...
We'll never know for shure though.

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Clueless · Post by **Clueless** » Thu Apr 12, 2007 10:34 pm

iono, god was the one who created time. i think it would be more like every million years is like a second for him.

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scherzo · Post by **scherzo** » Thu Apr 12, 2007 11:20 pm

i was under the impression there is no such thing as 'time'

i remember an experiment with mirrors, lights and a train, where the train would be moving down a track @ say 60 mph, the observer would hold the mirrors which were @ right angle to each other, they would turn on lights at the same time, observers outside the train seen the lights turn on at the same time, the observer with the mirrors however had seen one light then the other in the mirrors

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Stasi · Post by **Stasi** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:48 am

Time is just a measurement of existence. That it can be relative in some ways doesn't make it cease to exist as a measurement. I'm sure you look at the clock sometimes. I'm sure you have a concept of what an hour is. How can you say there's no such thing as time when aspects of your life are dictated by it?

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flowergirlajg · Post by **flowergirlajg** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 8:19 pm

GOOD POINT.

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Red Squirrel · Post by **Red Squirrel** » Fri Apr 27, 2007 12:28 am

Any date before January 1, 1970 is non existant. Thats when time actually started. (unix epoch

)

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Alistair · Post by **Alistair** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:11 am

Red Squirrel wrote: The big bang is a big joke. I mean come on, the big bang? Sounds like something a 8 year old made up. The theory itself also goes against many physics laws, such as creating matter from nothing. Only a super natural force such as God could possibly create something from nothing.

The big bang does NOT state that matter is created from nothing.
It states that matter was compressed to a single point, as a single atom.
From this the big bang took place, when that atom decomposed into many many many atoms of lesser atomic number.
(And no, this is not creating matter, fission bombs work the same by decomposing uranium atoms into lighter atoms).
The concept is simple.
Atoms are comprised of protons, neutrons, and electrons.
When they lose or gain these, ie, when a few of these leave the nucleus, they become different atoms.
Eg, 1 helium atom can decompose into 2 hydrogen atoms.

However, who's to say that God didn't cause the big-bang?

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Stasi · Post by **Stasi** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 9:54 am

Alistair wrote:
Red Squirrel wrote: The big bang is a big joke. I mean come on, the big bang? Sounds like something a 8 year old made up. The theory itself also goes against many physics laws, such as creating matter from nothing. Only a super natural force such as God could possibly create something from nothing.

Atoms are comprised of protons, neutrons, and electrons.
When they lose or gain these, ie, when a few of these leave the nucleus, they become different atoms.
Eg, 1 helium atom can decompose into 2 hydrogen atoms.

However, who's to say that God didn't cause the big-bang?

The loss or gain of an electron doesn't change the type of matter the atom is.

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Red Squirrel · Post by **Red Squirrel** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:54 pm

Hmm actually thats an interesting tought, atoms are basically defined by the number of electrons, and number of "orbits" (probably wrong term - have not studied chemisty in ages

). But guess shifting those completely would just make it an isotope. You can take molecules and change up the atoms to make them different molecules, but don't know if that can be done with atoms.

And here's a fun thought, the space between the electrons and the neutron is empty space, and think its like 90% of the atom, so most of it is empty space. So if you take an object and put it on top of another, at some point in time, if the electrons line up properly, the objects should sink into each other.

Mind bogling!

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Stasi · Post by **Stasi** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:52 pm

Actually, changing the composition of the nucleus (protons and neutrons) does change the atom's type. Remember, the atom's number on the periodic table is how many protons it has, so add or subtract some, and you get a different element.

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Alistair · Post by **Alistair** » Mon Jun 25, 2007 3:48 am

Stasi wrote:
Alistair wrote:
Red Squirrel wrote: The big bang is a big joke. I mean come on, the big bang? Sounds like something a 8 year old made up. The theory itself also goes against many physics laws, such as creating matter from nothing. Only a super natural force such as God could possibly create something from nothing.

Atoms are comprised of protons, neutrons, and electrons.
When they lose or gain these, ie, when a few of these leave the nucleus, they become different atoms.
Eg, 1 helium atom can decompose into 2 hydrogen atoms.

However, who's to say that God didn't cause the big-bang?

The loss or gain of an electron doesn't change the type of matter the atom is.

I should have been clearer.

Change in number of protons = Change in type of matter
Change in number of neutrons = Isotope
Change in number of electrons = Ion

What's interesting is that the atom that existed before the big bang must have had a super super super small half-life.
Think 10 to the minus power of a googleplex and it still wouldn't be close.

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