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my MAJOR complaint about the new bod system is that you can't do more than one type of quest before waiting for the timer. Most of us have all our crafting skills on 1 or 2 characters, now we will have to spread them out. I tried the new system once, did a tailor bod, went next door to the smith and tried to do a smith quest. Not being able to do a different crafting quest was all it took for me not to pursue it farther. But its that way for a reason I guess.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10253

The reason is to avoid farming high end rewards. The timer is totally random. What I could do is maybe make the NPC say how long till next one.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10254

right now it just seems like you have to do one type of gaming(crafting) for 30 minutes, then switch to fel pvm for 30 minutes, then do somn else for 30 minutes, then log in another character for something else...

It was a lot more fun when a few of us would run coon all after noon for scrolls and aoas. Now when I find one in T2A, it wont stay coon even when I valor it right after killing the champ. You could also do something about the chickens in sanders spawn, there is no way to finish that spawn unless you have a group of 4 or 5 people. Maybe take out the part of the chicken AI where they run like hell when they get hit with a wither... that way a person could take out 10 or so at a time instead of chasing one down while the other 9 heal back to full health.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10255

DOCTOR THUNDER wrote:right now it just seems like you have to do one type of gaming(crafting) for 30 minutes, then switch to fel pvm for 30 minutes, then do somn else for 30 minutes, then log in another character for something else...

It was a lot more fun when a few of us would run coon all after noon for scrolls and aoas. Now when I find one in T2A, it wont stay coon even when I valor it right after killing the champ. You could also do something about the chickens in sanders spawn, there is no way to finish that spawn unless you have a group of 4 or 5 people. Maybe take out the part of the chicken AI where they run like hell when they get hit with a wither... that way a person could take out 10 or so at a time instead of chasing one down while the other 9 heal back to full health.

OMG I hate when those blue bugger run when you try to hit them.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10256

LOL ya, but they are after all, chickens.

And it only makes sense for a mob that has 0 wrestling but magery to keep distance. What I try to do is trap them all in a building and wither like mad while using firehorn, poison flute, and summons.


What I might do though is remove the part of town region there so spells like wild fire, EQ etc can be used.


Also the valor thing is a bug, was fixed a long time ago. Demise never and probably never will fix that. I remember we used to exploit that so bad lol. We got like 100 PSes in one night while e. was busy haxing up despise.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10257

DOCTOR THUNDER wrote:the archer nerfs are rediculous. Swing speed = nerfed, damage = nerfed, and now you have to stand in the same spot for 1.75 seconds before shooting. When I was fighting on the field, I would hit the person with serp arrow and they would have enough time to cast cure multiple times and even heal up before i could shoot again. Red won't listen to me though, he thinks thats balanced.

If he makes bows shoot as fast as they used to...then he should unlock Explo and make MA spammable.

Quit bitching about retarded dexxer templates being crippled, when they are lame as hell to play, and keep working on your mage pvpers...

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10258

I'm debating on making archery 1.5, but I'm not sure yet. If I do, it will come with a HCI distance penalty. (farther you are = less chance to hit) I've played pvp and pvm archers and do fine shooting slower then cap... Win some, lose some, but overall I've always did fine with my archer. I'm not all that good at pvp either. So really I don't think it needs to be faster, its already quite fast. I do perfectly fine with my archer soloing demitels. Not the same as pvp, but chiv archer is made for pvm anyway.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10259

In response to monsters being too hard, I took out a char I hardly ever play with, and the char is not really optimized for pvm.

http://uosrv.uovalor.com/stuff/Black Squirrel_11-7_22.39.rpv

Stuff like serpentine DRAGONS are suppose to be hard, so yeah, the fact that I had a bit of trouble taking two at once should be considered normal. Someone with slayers would not have that problem though.

Think of mobs as players. If a player that plays a mage had 480 hit points and 1k mana, of course they'd be hard to kill.

But to accommodate newer players, I toned down the AI by lots and it will be in next update, but stuff like bosses will remain the same, they're bosses, they're suppose to be hard, and not really meant to be soloed, those who do solo them are to expect it to be hard.

I don't play WoW, but from what I hear, bosses there take like 30 people. Just for some comparison.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10260

the archery nerfs are retarted Red, whether you want to realize that or not. Only doing 12 damage in pvp cripples archers to begin with, we can't even interrupt bandage heals. Then when we have to sit in the same place forever just to shoot again, our target can heal up and cast spells at us or just run off screen. This is all while we wait to just shoot again. You are a being very close minded about the caps, because you think archers should be pvm. Everyone has to play a mage here since you nerfed the shit out of dexxers.

Thats why I play more on demise, I can pvp competitively with both my mage AND my archer.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10261

basically, what I think some people are trying to say is that you guys have nerfed or balanced the fun out of a lot of stuff.

Fel - no point being there for long. get your AoA then get out.

Baracoon - I used to do coons for fun, so people could come down and raid. Now with the insane rat mage AI and the frustrating rat archer AI (they run just outside of wither range now), its too much work to do the spawn and watch for raids. On top of that, no matter what, I know I am turning into a fucking rat somehow when I get to coon. Its not worth it now. If I do coon, its in T2A somewhere. And since you guys "fixed" it where I can't valor the idol and get the same spawn, I don't do many champs.

Gauntlet - gauntlet was marginal fun at best, now its a frustrating game of chase the monster at 20% health while it spams heal. thats really fun with the Dark Father.

Getting a gold skull - Recall into doom, screen turns black and white. Skele dragons were "fixed" so they wont animate... great, there goes the easiest and fastest way to get daemon bones.

Sanders spawn - people used to do that champ a lot in britian, now its been "fixed" so its impossible without a group of players. What makes it impossible is on 4th tier you used to be able to kill enough of the other monsters to get to the champ, now its just a mass spawn of vorpal chickens and they have been given the "run like hell and spam heal" AI.

Bod/crafting - pointless

Mining - "fixed", now you need to put mining into your PvM template

Archery - pvm only, Red isnt budging on that one

Taming - why tame something when its gonna be nerfed next week

Pvm - challenging for us with godly suits, I hate to think of how it seems to new players. the heal loop thing really needs to be fixed though. Perhaps a monster damage cap on blood oath too, its not fun to get oathed for 180+ damage and instantly die.

Tokuno champ - that champ was 'fixed" so 2nd tier is constant deadly poison and can cause almost instant death from Kappas.

Alchemy - exp pots were 'fixed"

Bushido - evasion was "fixed"

Yoshis - I think everyone misses 1 slot yoshis

Vorpal chicken spawn - "fixed" so its a pain in the ass to camp

House hiding and brit gate fighting - Fixed right from the start. People whine and cry about that a lot, but its at least SOMETHING to do in fel. Its been replaced by argentinian duel safe zone fighting. For god's sake, don't fix that! its at least mildly amusing.

Basically you have made a server where its mostly PvM. Lots of shiny bright neon special items. PvP is a mage only club. A lot more chance to die from what most people assume are easy monsters. Less stuff is appealing to do because of all the changes and fixes.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10262

Demise pvp is all about darts and ma/fireball spam.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10263

agreed with doc on some points, especially the mob healing, thats just wrong and hax and annoying. but to bring a point of view from someone who doesnt pvp that much (and sucks at it).

Challenge is part of the game, at the moment it seems that you could solo the whole freakin shard, and the toughness of some mobs and spawns forces people to group up, which, in my humble opinion, is the point in mmorpgs. this of course is subjected to the player base which is about 10 regular players. and aov being community based, the ten players who make suggestions which are brought into game, maybe not so good for the shard in the long run. tho most of these i liked but sometimes it just isnt a cool thing (hope you get my point there).

maybe we get to see what the shard is like with 200+ players someday now it feels like that all these nerfs are directed at the 10 players who visit uov, not the shard at whole. maybe thats intentional tho.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10264

The changes are to look at the future. if I would of let things (such as the AWs) the way they were, it would only get worse. Dungeons like twisted weald are supose to be hard and supose to take team work. when a tamer that has 20 of each resist can go in there and solo the whole thing, something is not right.

Also things like balrons, skeletal dragons, or 5 liches in same spot, are supose to be hard. Even with the advanced AI I can solo paragon versions of those with little to no effort with my pvm char. And I melee.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10265

DOCTOR THUNDER wrote:basically, what I think some people are trying to say is that you guys have nerfed or balanced the fun out of a lot of stuff.

Fel - no point being there for long. get your AoA then get out.

Baracoon - I used to do coons for fun, so people could come down and raid. Now with the insane rat mage AI and the frustrating rat archer AI (they run just outside of wither range now), its too much work to do the spawn and watch for raids. On top of that, no matter what, I know I am turning into a fucking rat somehow when I get to coon. Its not worth it now. If I do coon, its in T2A somewhere. And since you guys "fixed" it where I can't valor the idol and get the same spawn, I don't do many champs.

Gauntlet - gauntlet was marginal fun at best, now its a frustrating game of chase the monster at 20% health while it spams heal. thats really fun with the Dark Father.

Getting a gold skull - Recall into doom, screen turns black and white. Skele dragons were "fixed" so they wont animate... great, there goes the easiest and fastest way to get daemon bones.

Sanders spawn - people used to do that champ a lot in britian, now its been "fixed" so its impossible without a group of players. What makes it impossible is on 4th tier you used to be able to kill enough of the other monsters to get to the champ, now its just a mass spawn of vorpal chickens and they have been given the "run like hell and spam heal" AI.

Bod/crafting - pointless

Mining - "fixed", now you need to put mining into your PvM template

Archery - pvm only, Red isnt budging on that one

Taming - why tame something when its gonna be nerfed next week

Pvm - challenging for us with godly suits, I hate to think of how it seems to new players. the heal loop thing really needs to be fixed though. Perhaps a monster damage cap on blood oath too, its not fun to get oathed for 180+ damage and instantly die.

Tokuno champ - that champ was 'fixed" so 2nd tier is constant deadly poison and can cause almost instant death from Kappas.

Alchemy - exp pots were 'fixed"

Bushido - evasion was "fixed"

Yoshis - I think everyone misses 1 slot yoshis

Vorpal chicken spawn - "fixed" so its a pain in the ass to camp

House hiding and brit gate fighting - Fixed right from the start. People whine and cry about that a lot, but its at least SOMETHING to do in fel. Its been replaced by argentinian duel safe zone fighting. For god's sake, don't fix that! its at least mildly amusing.

Basically you have made a server where its mostly PvM. Lots of shiny bright neon special items. PvP is a mage only club. A lot more chance to die from what most people assume are easy monsters. Less stuff is appealing to do because of all the changes and fixes.

Amen, i know I for one have had the fun sucked from the shard i used to enjoy coon, well i cant solo that now, i was also quite close to getting a few good bods done, now all i get is crappy cloth and a 1 charge powder WOOT, i was so desperate to get a AW i payed a aoa for help taming one, a week later i wouldnt pay a iron ingot for 20 of them, didnt really do gaunt but by the sounds of it ill never be able to anyway , twisted wield is probably ment to b about team work, kinda hard when theres a total of 10 ppl on the shard to gather a team, i think uve sucessfully chased away about 7 of the 10 player base heres a darwin award

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10266

What I could do is make it so all mobs have 100 hp, and have 100% chance to drop a random artifact deed.

If that does not work, then I can just cancel the server, and thats 150 bucks per month extra in my pockets.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10267

meh why not, nurfed everything else may as well nurf the server too, bye all it was fun before the "fixes" any who wish to remain in contact ill b on demise it may be far from perfect but atleast its fun

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10268

fun?
Not sure about that, when like 90% of the stuff we have here is not there, and never will be. By the time demise even gets close to reaching what we have here, hell will freeze over and Toronto maple leafs will win the stanley cup, the same day.


http://www.uovalor.com/whyjoin.php

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10269

Let's get real instead of talking smack. I think the real problem is the same one I was discussing with Brunus a long time back. Since the shard has a small population, it should be *designed* towards a small population. What this means is that things *should* be soloable with an uber suit/skills, or with 2 or 3 people with ok suits/skills. Otherwise, while the shard may have these cool things, if there are never enough people on then you would never be able to do those things = not fun.

Think back to how demitels used to be. People could solo them with a great suit or pet and had a 20% chance at a demitel artifact. That was fun. You could also solo most champs and get some good PSes. This is what made people come to this shard IMO. AoA's used to be fun to collect, but now they drop way too infrequently and have become a huge chore. That's not fun. I don't think I've gotten a greater AoA in over a month because they are so difficult to acquire, that's not fun. Seriously, greater AoA's are now harder to acquire than demitel arties.

When the shard population begins to rise, then changes can be put into place gradually and slowly to compensate for the extra amount of players. So even though I agree with most of the changes going in, I think they are way too fast and premature. Don't think about what will happen when there are lots of players until there are lots of players. I fully understand that some things are supposed to be hard, but if there are only 10 people on and you don't know any of them and/or they don't wanna do what you want, the difficulty of the possible activities should be set accordingly.

Let me give you a couple of examples of things that made me have lots of fun on AOV:

- Using Lore on a yellow yoshi for the first time, then spend days looking for 5 perfect ones and using them.
- Going to obscure places in Fel in order to kill high fame monsters and wishing for that first essence of spellcasting (omg, 30lrc and 4mr)
- Running around Malas and by accident finding a rare legendary steed (which actually lived up to the title of being legendary)
- Being able to kill Humus with a special very rare pet (how often does Humus die these days).
- Being able to kill Darth Vader, albeit usually dying numerous times.

I think this shard is the best one that I've ever played on. I think that once more players are on, this shard will rocket to one of the top shards. But in order to do that, the shard has to be focused on a small player base until the numbers pick up. And I think that the changes that need to be made as the number rises need to be small and gradual changes.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10270

Hah... this sparked a pretty big debate.

Well I wasn't suggesting to close down the server. I don't even mind a lot of the changes. Actually, I think I can narrow the issues I have down to a couple specifics (remember that I am speaking for my wife who is almost entirely into crafting and collecting here).

I'll start with the crafting and resource gathering.
The timers being combined for the multiple reward and BOD systems should possibly be split into multiple seperate timers if possible. It would be cool if the old system (Despite how impossible the odds may have appeared) could remain in tandom with the new system for people that like getting and filling the BODs. Red, I like the idea you mentioned about the NPC's saying how long it will be until your next one is available.

I'm going to get into the meat and potatos of what really has been getting to me lately. The changes individually aren't all so bad, but more the reasoning. This server was made to be a very uber server right from the start. A lot of things were in fact made to compensate on the PvM side such as hell of a lot better monster AI and dungeons that are crazy hard to balance out all the cool artifacts, items, and uber pets that were put in. I think that some of the stuff to address this has been going on right as far as making easy spawned dungeons for newbies, medium to hard normal dungeons for advanced players to solo, and pretty much all the peerless dungeons that require teams. Those concepts are great. Now stay with me here. The catch phrase at the top of ever page you see on this website is "Built by players for players". Even with the uber loot and pets and anything else that seemed like it could give an advantage, could have been fixed without taking anything away from players or lowering caps in any way. Rather, you scale the rewards available in certain areas to fit the level of area played. Make regular loot and minor arties available in newbie dungeons. Make minor and not as high end of greater arties available in the advanced soloable areas, and make the uber ultimate rewards in hardest places. Make places that people with the most uber pets and a group of people still have to fight and die a bit in order to earn the reward. Ok, to take this in a slightly different angle for a bit. Red posted recently how the server just got an upgrade in processor and memory. He also posted how very little bandwidth is being used most or all the time. Why is people afk resource gathering a big deal? Did it really do anything to ruin fun for anyone? Did it really hurt anyone? Other than increasing the item count it didn't cause that big of a problem did it? I think the old BOD system and the AFK gathering wasn't that big of a deal. I think that getting people used to something and then taking it away is getting old for everyone.

If you seriously want to keep gaining people as well as not losing people at the same rateyou need to listen to your players. Keep doing the super fantactic job that nobidy can deny you as far as adding and keeping up with the expansions and content. Have more events as much as possible. I don't know if you can even create an event system that players can start up themselves, that would allow a player to donate a reward into the even system and run some kind of mini event so that other players can compete for that given prize. No economy inflation required. With that said, don't keep tweaking and balancing things. Let people get used to a given system and players will adapt to a play style. Most or all of the people that have left during the course of this year didn't leave because you didn't have all the peerless dungeons done yet, or because they were worried about AFK resource gathering. They left due to nerfs in PvP abilities, pet nerfs, Artie nerfs, and pretty much anything done to try to balance imaginary issues that nobody was complaining about.

Undo a good majority of the player facing changes and start making the server itself scalable in difficulty and reward, and that will be way better for balance, and still keep things fun.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10271

Red Squirrel wrote:fun?
Not sure about that, when like 90% of the stuff we have here is not there, and never will be. By the time demise even gets close to reaching what we have here, hell will freeze over and Toronto maple leafs will win the stanley cup, the same day.


http://www.uovalor.com/whyjoin.php

Sorry to keep picking on you here, but I think we all have already given you props for features way beyond Demise. Please please please stop bringing Demise into this. Nobody cares about Demise and how far behind they are on ML content.

Do I sound cranky lately? lol

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10272

i've been wondering that anti-demise attitude too, sounds kinda childish, no offense is there a somekinda drama behind all it?

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10273

Well people often get pissy and say they'll go back to demise, so I kind of have to remind them what demise really is. Anyone can download RunUO and fire up an exact replica of Demise. Demise is basically that, a default RunUO install. So when people start saying its more fun there I take offense considering the countless hours and IRL money that is put into this shard.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10276

Damn, I had to read this during my shift. I could easily blow 50 minutes writing some responses. I'll be sure to do that when I get back home. I see a lot of delicious posts.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10277

What i think is that we should keep things stable for a while, instead of doing something dramatical like making runic bows cursed (i paid my ass off to get one from altar back in the days) also like nerfing the hp cap (took ages to find the items for that huge hp, also took ages to solo/do all them demitels to get some edge over others, i enjoyed killing them as i had a goal) Those things i wrote are things that changed my gameplay by huge, and yes i said my, as iam talking about myself.

Now the only things i enjoy is trying to get my suit good again (which got directly nerfed too, atleast it felt like it cause every arty i used got nerfed one way or another)

another thing i enjoyed for a while was trying to get parrots, mainly collecting items i'd say.

Pvp would be extremetly fun too, eventho archers are like shooting dummies now, i'd still be ready to try and fight with one still using my necro/chiv/archer template.
Plus, pvp is non existant, theres absolutly no point checking coon / wrong for some people, as noone is there, only place where someone might be is destard.

Why noone is in coon or wrong is becouse they got boosted, also vader is impossible now and humus is moved plus boosted = no pvp.

Of course there'd be factions pvp but thing is, there isnt any factions really, i dont even know what guild is the one leading SL alliance now.

One other thign what annoys me is that everytime someone says demise on aov forums, he is adversing demise, be it good or bad.

Also what i dont like is when SW's are messed up big time, sw's are almost only chance to pvp now.




My suggestion is to take of the coon nerf, put demitels to fel and nerf them a bit, nerf vader a bit.... but make couple new monsters which are harder and give bigger chance of arty and so on, to wait for the times when theres more people on and you wanna do something harder.
Also removing archer dmg cap would be pretty nice, as i dont think anyone who complained about is is playing on aov nowdays.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10284

[global delete ? Server wipe? Put everyone back on square one. Then we won't have all these people bitchin' about, "what this server once was" or what is imbalanced.

Archived topic from AOV, old topic ID:1616, old post ID:10285