/facepalm

Chyse · Post by **Chyse** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:45 am

So my Physics teacher is a huge "nature boy," and we're watching An Inconvenient Truth. *sigh* Dontcha hate it when teachers force you to watch things that impose their political views on you?

Like my International Relations (Current Events) teacher last year made us watch two, TWO Micheal Moore movies. Now, you have to understand that Indiana is a RED state. And Micheal Moore is not exactly the most loved person. However my teacher was very liberal and he thought he'd show them.

Now i'm not going to express my feelings about the movies themselves, but about the fact that teachers find it okay to show movies like these in classrooms where students are forced to watch them.
I think the reason it's allowed in my school is because it's a private school. But is it fair that i am forced to watch a movie about a political view i'm opposed to? Isn't that like... brainwashing? lol okay brainwashing is a little extreme, but you know what i mean.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63141

Bookworm · Post by **Bookworm** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:24 pm

I think that if you are not familiar with the opposing viewpoints, then you will never be able to adequately defend your own viewpoints. I do wonder, though, how many teachers who show the Michael Moore videos would be willing to show a video in class which presented the opposing perspective. Not very many, I bet.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63145

Stasi · Post by **Stasi** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:25 pm

Yeah, it's pretty sad. Michael Moore is not a documentarian, nor is "An Inconvenient Truth" full of truth. Some of this retarded crap is becoming the new orthodoxy that, should you oppose it, you are looked down upon.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63146

Stasi · Post by **Stasi** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:25 pm

Bookworm wrote: I think that if you are not familiar with the opposing viewpoints, then you will never be able to adequately defend your own viewpoints. I do wonder, though, how many teachers who show the Michael Moore videos would be willing to show a video in class which presented the opposing perspective. Not very many, I bet.

That's the problem. Most of these instructors don't show these sorts of videos in the context of showing two sides of an issue.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63148

Bookworm · Post by **Bookworm** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:31 pm

goalguarder12 wrote:
I think the reason it's allowed in my school is because it's a private school. But is it fair that i am forced to watch a movie about a political view i'm opposed to? Isn't that like... brainwashing? lol okay brainwashing is a little extreme, but you know what i mean.

I think the private school issue would apply in a greater degree to "religious right" type issues, rather than to the allowing of Michael Moore films. What type of private school do you go to? You may have mentioned it sometime previously, but I've forgotten if you have.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63149

Chyse · Post by **Chyse** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 2:00 pm

Bookworm wrote:
goalguarder12 wrote:
I think the reason it's allowed in my school is because it's a private school. But is it fair that i am forced to watch a movie about a political view i'm opposed to? Isn't that like... brainwashing? lol okay brainwashing is a little extreme, but you know what i mean.

I think the private school issue would apply in a greater degree to "religious right" type issues, rather than to the allowing of Michael Moore films. What type of private school do you go to? You may have mentioned it sometime previously, but I've forgotten if you have.

It's a Catholic school.

And as bookworm said in the first post, i don't think most teachers would show an opposing movie, however, there aren't nearly as many right-sided movies as there are left sided movies.

And, If they think we're so ill-informed, then that's a huge insult to the entire student body. Do they think we can know the quantum theory of light and the theory of relativity extensively, but not know what side we're on on political issues?

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63150

Bookworm · Post by **Bookworm** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 2:27 pm

goalguarder12 wrote: And, If they think we're so ill-informed, then that's a huge insult to the entire student body.

Why would that be an insult? Isn't it a fact that people ARE ill-informed until they get the information that would make them informed?

Do they think we can know the quantum theory of light and the theory of relativity extensively, but not know what side we're on on political issues?

But you don't know about the quantum theory of light until you are taught, do you? I guess they figure you don't know what side of a political issue you are supposed to be on until you are taught.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63152

Bookworm · Post by **Bookworm** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 3:32 pm

Stasi wrote:
Bookworm wrote: I think that if you are not familiar with the opposing viewpoints, then you will never be able to adequately defend your own viewpoints. I do wonder, though, how many teachers who show the Michael Moore videos would be willing to show a video in class which presented the opposing perspective. Not very many, I bet.

That's the problem. Most of these instructors don't show these sorts of videos in the context of showing two sides of an issue.

Yeah, we have the same situation with the evolution/creation issue. Most kids are just shown the evolution side in school and the other side is never presented.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63154

manadren · Post by **manadren** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 5:54 pm

Bookworm wrote:
Stasi wrote:
Bookworm wrote: I think that if you are not familiar with the opposing viewpoints, then you will never be able to adequately defend your own viewpoints. I do wonder, though, how many teachers who show the Michael Moore videos would be willing to show a video in class which presented the opposing perspective. Not very many, I bet.

That's the problem. Most of these instructors don't show these sorts of videos in the context of showing two sides of an issue.

Yeah, we have the same situation with the evolution/creation issue. Most kids are just shown the evolution side in school and the other side is never presented.

hoo boy, that's the start of an argument, which belongs in another thread. I will say this though. Evolution is science, creation is theology. Intelligent design is creation with a coat of paint. The reason creation and ID is not taught in science classes is because it is counter to the methodology of science. And in science you are teaching as much the methodology as the current consensus.

But getting back to the original topic. I'd say the issue is a lot more complex than that. Sure the blatant forcing of a particular political ideology over all others onto a class isn't that great. But you can't really expect a teacher to be completely agnostic on all subjects either. I would say a good teacher presents their opinion as well as the opposing argument, and welcomes dissenting dialog (which exceptions of course, refer to comment about evolution.). A teacher can and should share their opinion on the issues, but it should be well qualified as their opinion. Much of our lives revolves around wieghing the opinions of experts. Whether it's the author of your text book, your minister, family doctor, or local mechanic. Should we tell our children that everything is purely objective?

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63156

Bookworm · Post by **Bookworm** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 5:41 pm

manadren wrote: hoo boy, that's the start of an argument, which belongs in another thread.

And I didn't bring it up to actually start the argument, but simply to point out a situation other than poiltics in which there are more than one side to an issue.

The reason creation and ID is not taught in science classes is because it is counter to the methodology of science. And in science you are teaching as much the methodology as the current consensus.

That's a pretty concise way of stating it.

It's just that when teaching science, we often imply that scientific methods are the only appropraite methodology for understanding the world.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63213

Chyse · Post by **Chyse** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 9:26 pm

And, If they think we're so ill-informed, then that's a huge insult to the entire student body.

Why would that be an insult? Isn't it a fact that people ARE ill-informed until they get the information that would make them informed?

It's insulting to say that we wouldn't take the liberty to look up issues ourselves. If we wanted to learn about both sides of a issue, we'd enroll in a class or get a club started (we already have a few). Such as debate. Not only does it teach debate, but you're also required to debate real life issues. and you have to see both sides.
Them thinking we're not responsible enough to find ways to learn about issues is an insult. We join math classes to learn about math, they assume we wont take classes or research to learn about our own beliefs and that is what's insulting.

Do they think we can know the quantum theory of light and the theory of relativity extensively, but not know what side we're on on political issues?

But you don't know about the quantum theory of light until you are taught, do you? I guess they figure you don't know what side of a political issue you are supposed to be on until you are taught.

But we seek out classes or sources to learn the quantum theory of light, yet don't think we're intelligent enough to find ways to learn about political issues?

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63217

manadren · Post by **manadren** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 9:33 pm

Bookworm wrote:
manadren wrote: hoo boy, that's the start of an argument, which belongs in another thread.
And I didn't bring it up to actually start the argument, but simply to point out a situation other than poiltics in which there are more than one side to an issue.
The reason creation and ID is not taught in science classes is because it is counter to the methodology of science. And in science you are teaching as much the methodology as the current consensus.
That's a pretty concise way of stating it. It's just that when teaching science, we often imply that scientific methods are the only appropraite methodology for understanding the world.

But what do you expect from a science class? If a science teacher does not impart upon a student that potential of science to explain almost everything, he's not doing his job right. The same thing goes for a preacher. It's where these and other viewpoints intersect where your world view ultimately lies.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63220

Chris Vogel · Post by **Chris Vogel** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 10:32 pm

GG, I don’t know what kind of teachers you have, but maybe you could talk to them about it? They don’t always listen, but, at least in my experience, they don’t hold grudges either. Just be civil, bring proof, and do it in private.

Archived topic from Anythingforums, old topic ID:3447, old post ID:63223