Anthropogenic Global Warming

[Stasi]

"Anthropogenc" global warming means human induced global warming.

Do you believe in it? Do you fear its consequences? What can be done to stop it?

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[scherzo]

yes I believe in it, yes I fear its consequences, Nothing short of a revolution (like industrial or information) can be done to remedy it

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[Stasi]

What has led you to believe it? Do you believe that it is likely that the problem will be prevented by sufficient action, or is the climate catastrophe inevitable?

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[manadren]

I would say that humanity has contributed to the problem considerably, but part of global warming is the natural cycles of the earth. Not to say that anthropogenic global warming is a myth or a non-issue but rather we are causing something that happens normally to occur at an abnormal rate. A catastrophe is ahead, but maybe not as soon or on the scale that the alarmists think.

As for how what can be done to stop it, I think you already know all the stock answers. Thing is alternative fuel sources and earth friendly production and waste management isn't exactly profitable, and I have no doubt that there are those with lots of money and power want to keep it that way (because it cuts into their profits and they don't have viable alternatives of their own to sell yet). The real trick is how to make earth friendly profitable on a grand scale.

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[scherzo]

What has led you to believe it?  Do you believe that it is likely that the problem will be prevented by sufficient action, or is the climate catastrophe inevitable?

The sky was bluer when I was younger ( at least my memories tell me so ) is what lead me to believe it - then there are the pictures of earth from the first space missions compared to the pictures of today

I don't konw what sufficient action entails or what would be concidered a catastrophe. Hurricane katrina was only a catastrophe cause it hit new orleans, weather related disasters will and have happened and will continue to happen.

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[Bookworm]

The sky was bluer when I was younger (

Does the sky change color as the temperature warms? I don't think that was in Gore's book.

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[scherzo]

The sky was bluer when I was younger (

Does the sky change color as the temperature warms? I don't think that was in Gore's book.

the colour changes from the light refracting off 'stuff' in the air


I have officially used 'stuff' in a scientific term

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[Red Squirrel]

I definately believe it. There may be some natural changes that happen as well, but not to the extent or speed of global warming right now. And scary part is, it's a real reality, specially when you start hearing news channels talk about how we need to reduce it. But guess what, it's too late. Unless we act right NOW, but things like that take too long to change.

We need to completely illimitate all emission producing systems and replace them with 100% non pollution. So cars, generators, lawnmowers, boats, busses, planes, change factory proceedures that are polluting, etc etc... some of this stuff is near impossible to change, while some is held back by the greedy oil industry who won't allow alternatives to be put in use so they patent them all. Come to think of it, even a recycling plant probably producing pollution, from melting plastic and such. But throwing all that plastic in the landfill would be worse.


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[scherzo]

an alternative to changing an engines fuel is to build huge air scrubbers for large cities, perhaps like this stuff

solid smoke




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[Red Squirrel]

solid smoke is awesome, Nasa uses that stuff, for stuff.

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[scherzo]

solid smoke is awesome, Nasa uses that stuff, for stuff.

they used it to collect 'space dust' from a passing comet. but yeah, i've been know to use 'stuff' in a scientific definiton

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[Stasi]

yes I believe in it, yes I fear its consequences, Nothing short of a revolution (like industrial or information) can be done to remedy it

Which won't happen since both China and India will keep emitting "greenhouse" gases more and more every year despite what the West does.

Manadren said:

As for how what can be done to stop it, I think you already know all the stock answers. Thing is alternative fuel sources and earth friendly production and waste management isn't exactly profitable, and I have no doubt that there are those with lots of money and power want to keep it that way (because it cuts into their profits and they don't have viable alternatives of their own to sell yet). The real trick is how to make earth friendly profitable on a grand scale.

A few nights ago on the "Newshour with Jim Lehrer" I saw a story about how BP (a major oil company) gave either a $300 or $500 million dollar grant to a Berkeley lab to work on biofuels. I don't know, but the more I learn about the industry of "earth-friendliness", at the very least, academic institutions and other private entities are getting big dollar grants from corporations and governments all over the world. It seems to me more and more that the real money is on the side of the alarmists.

Scherzo said:

I don't konw what sufficient action entails or what would be concidered a catastrophe. Hurricane katrina was only a catastrophe cause it hit new orleans, weather related disasters will and have happened and will continue to happen.

So, are you saying that hurricane Katrina was caused by global warming? The UN report on global warming, if I recall correctly, downplayed the effect of global warming on hurricanes in the near term. If I recall correctly from the scientific literature, last year, there were fewer hurricanes than the year previous.

Red Squirrel said:

I definately believe it. There may be some natural changes that happen as well, but not to the extent or speed of global warming right now. And scary part is, it's a real reality, specially when you start hearing news channels talk about how we need to reduce it. But guess what, it's too late. Unless we act right NOW, but things like that take too long to change.

News channels are run by human beings with interests. You'll be hard-pressed to find a really good news service. I can't stand any of the major networks' nightly "news" programs here in the states (ABC, CBS, NBC). And also understand that the earth is always either warming or cooling and that only a few decades ago, the scientific establishment was afraid of an upcoming ice age, not global warming. To suddenly say, over the last few decades, that the earth is headed for a man-made global warming catastrophe seems quite short-sighted to me.

I don't buy into the global warming orthodoxy that insists I believe the hype. I don't buy into doomsday prophecies whether they come from religious nuts or scientists (both of whom have made numerous apocalyptic prophecies with zero occurrences).

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[manadren]

Manadren said:

As for how what can be done to stop it, I think you already know all the stock answers. Thing is alternative fuel sources and earth friendly production and waste management isn't exactly profitable, and I have no doubt that there are those with lots of money and power want to keep it that way (because it cuts into their profits and they don't have viable alternatives of their own to sell yet). The real trick is how to make earth friendly profitable on a grand scale.

A few nights ago on the "Newshour with Jim Lehrer" I saw a story about how BP (a major oil company) gave either a $300 or $500 million dollar grant to a Berkeley lab to work on biofuels. I don't know, but the more I learn about the industry of "earth-friendliness", at the very least, academic institutions and other private entities are getting big dollar grants from corporations and governments all over the world. It seems to me more and more that the real money is on the side of the alarmists.

Yeah, BP has been pretty big on promoting their green efforts. Some are moving in the right direction. No doubt all of the big oil companies have thought about green alternatives, but they are more concerned with the money they are making today, rather than plans for tomorrow. Part of the problem is that it hasn't been until recently that companies have really started investing in R&D for greener technologies, and they are all a long way off. But as I said, until that day comes, big oil is going to be doing everything it can to make that extra buck today.

Jumping off on a bit of a wild tangent though, I think the oil companies are going through a similar situation as the Recording and Motion Picture industries right now. They are too slow in adapting to the changing consumer demand and complications in foreign affairs, which results in the consumer getting shafted (sky high gas prices). They in turn have an adverse affect on the automotive industry, limiting what they can make. Sure I'll admit that hydrogen fueled cars aren't ready, but there's no reason why we can't be running on ethanol, biodeisel, or electricity right now. And the way people have been complaining about gas prices, you can't say there isn't a market.

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[Stasi]

Sure I'll admit that hydrogen fueled cars aren't ready, but there's no reason why we can't be running on ethanol, biodeisel, or electricity right now. And the way people have been complaining about gas prices, you can't say there isn't a market.

I'm not sold on all of the biofuel hoopla. I can't imagine a world running on the stuff without major environmental repercussions.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5184874

http://petroleum.berkeley.edu/patzek/Biofu...archive2006.htm

http://grist.org/news/maindish/2006/12/04/...s/index.html#Ii

http://www.spiegel.de/international/0,1518,439809,00.html

http://www.foe.co.uk/resource/press_releas...f_10042007.html



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